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Messages - BackInTime9

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16
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2020 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: March 18, 2019, 04:09:38 PM »
What looks like and is assumed to be "trough" for the new water attraction appears to be awfully narrow for traditional river rapids rafts like that of the old LRO or an Infinity Falls type ride. Is the photo just deceiving, or is there chance the raft system will be something all together new and different?

17
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2020 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: January 04, 2019, 11:22:19 AM »
Quote from: BackInTime9
Beyond an attraction to cool off during the dead of summer, can someone please help me understand what the novelty, or allure is with spending millions of dollars on a river rapids ride in 2020? So Infinity Falls has a unique loading and lift system and a 40 foot drop? Not sure I get the wow factor. Not trying to be a pessimist, but even that doesn't feel like anything revolutionary to an already relatively mundane ride concept. Is this simply a necessary evil for the PTB in terms of keeping a people eater in the center of the park for the dog days when it's filled to capacity and many welcome any refuge from the elements they can find? If and only if this took shape in a highly themed way, a la Disney's Kali River Rapids, then I could get on board. Have no doubt whatever fills the space will look nice, but without anything thematic in terms of the ride experience, it's just going to be another river rapids ride, even if it has a state-of-the-art lift system and an underwhelming drop of over 40 ft that puts into the "tallest" category.

LR was due for a very expensive rehab.  The ride system they had was lacking several modern safety measures and was far from being ADA compliant.  The trough was losing a lot water every day due to large cracks that it had occurred over the years due to neglect and a couple earthquakes. 

As far as you not personally getting the “wow factor” - you’re not the target audience so that’s to be expected. 

It’s a little early in the process for the outrage in the rest of your post as nothing has been made public. 

Let’s pump the breaks for now and wait for the process to play out.  You got two years to worry yet.

Outrage? I was simply asking an honest question. And I think it's a bit unfair not to mention presumptuous to say I'm not the audience for a river rapids ride. As I stated in my post, I wasn't insinuating anything. Merely asking the question about it's need an validity. Are rapids rides my favorite thing? No. Will I ride them? Of course. As will my kids. So yes, Swoosh, I am the target audience.

18
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2020 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: January 03, 2019, 04:33:12 PM »
Swoosh, what is your confidence level in the speculation that LOR is being truly being razed for a new water attraction versus something else? As you pointed out with your recent pictures, with Lake Silver gone (even if temporarily), that is a very large footprint capable of accommodating just about anything HFEC would want to put there. Also, outside of retaining natural aesthetics, what value would incorporating a newer Lake Silver hold? This is awfully valuable real estate to have a lake with no purpose. I'm not insinuating anything. As long as we're still speculating, I'm simply wondering if the entire cleared footprint will be utilized for whatever attraction is in the works for '20, or they're clearing everything to make way for the attraction, which will include some newer iteration of Lake Silver, if that makes sense.

98% sure and about 80% sure it’ll be like Infinity Falls. 
New LR is only a small part of this new project.  They’re being very tight lipped on what’ll happen eventually around Riverfront Playhouse.  They don’t refer to it as “the most valuable land in the park” for nothing

Beyond an attraction to cool off during the dead of summer, can someone please help me understand what the novelty, or allure is with spending millions of dollars on a river rapids ride in 2020? So Infinity Falls has a unique loading and lift system and a 40 foot drop? Not sure I get the wow factor. Not trying to be a pessimist, but even that doesn't feel like anything revolutionary to an already relatively mundane ride concept. Is this simply a necessary evil for the PTB in terms of keeping a people eater in the center of the park for the dog days when it's filled to capacity and many welcome any refuge from the elements they can find? If and only if this took shape in a highly themed way, a la Disney's Kali River Rapids, then I could get on board. Have no doubt whatever fills the space will look nice, but without anything thematic in terms of the ride experience, it's just going to be another river rapids ride, even if it has a state-of-the-art lift system and an underwhelming drop of over 40 ft that puts into the "tallest" category.

19
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2020 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: January 02, 2019, 04:49:18 PM »
Swoosh, what is your confidence level in the speculation that LOR is being truly being razed for a new water attraction versus something else? As you pointed out with your recent pictures, with Lake Silver gone (even if temporarily), that is a very large footprint capable of accommodating just about anything HFEC would want to put there. Also, outside of retaining natural aesthetics, what value would incorporating a newer Lake Silver hold? This is awfully valuable real estate to have a lake with no purpose. I'm not insinuating anything. As long as we're still speculating, I'm simply wondering if the entire cleared footprint will be utilized for whatever attraction is in the works for '20, or they're clearing everything to make way for the attraction, which will include some newer iteration of Lake Silver, if that makes sense. 

20
In terms of speculation regarding a future coaster, would you all bet on another family investment a la TT and TNT, or do you think HFEC will opt to go for something bigger? While TT is their largest investment to date, I think we can probably all agree the coaster is intended to appeal to a broader demographic, versus catering to the ultimate thrill seeker. Just curious what the consensus is on a best guess around the next possible coaster addition at SDC? While I do agree a smaller family oriented coaster would still be a nice addition near FL and/or GE, I personally would like to see a landmark coaster anchoring some westward expansion beyond PK and OR.

21
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2018 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: March 16, 2018, 12:17:44 AM »
Actually to be balanced there needs to be a big ride back in GE and/or FL

I'll give you that, but you gotta crawl before you walk, right?

On that note, and perhaps this belongs in another thread, but in terms of speculation regarding a future coaster, would you bet on another family investment a la TT and TNT, or do you think HFEC will opt to go for something bigger? While TT is their largest investment to date, I think we can probably all agree the coaster is intended to provide broader, more family type appeal, versus catering to the ultimate thrill seeker. Just curious what the consensus is on a best guess around the next possible coaster addition at SDC. While I do agree a smaller family oriented coaster would still be a nice addition near FL and/or GE, I personally would like to see a landmark coaster anchoring some westward expansion beyond PK and OR. 

22
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2018 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: March 15, 2018, 11:57:18 AM »
I have yet to ride TT, but my favorite part of the ride is something no one is talking about right now – the reduced wait times we're sure to find on all the other coasters. The addition of another major coaster and more importantly, its placement, has brought some long overdue ride balance to SDC.

23
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2018 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: October 15, 2017, 12:02:07 AM »
^^^
Obviously a long way to go before March 2018, but man I sure hope a sufficient update to the area in front of and around TNT & TT is still part of the overall development plan for the addition. That area is going to be an absolute nightmare to traverse if they do not address it.

Additionally, I know it's been mentioned that it appears an observation deck will NOT be a part of TT. Can anyone tell me why the PTB would not see value in allowing non-riding patrons or those on the fence about riding their largest ride investment to date the opportunity to watch the ride on action first – especially given the already growing concerns about the presumed intensity of a spinning launched and inverted coaster? Just doesn't make an ounce of sense to me. Also seems like a miss given its location where a view from the front of the load station seems to almost overlook the majority of the circuit.

24
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2018 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: August 20, 2017, 12:57:42 AM »
Off topic a bit, I will chime in and say there apparently will be big changes to the SDC classics over the next 5 years from what me and Shave heard while at the media event. One being major changes to Flooded Mine come next year as more of the structure is coming down. People might or might not be happy with the coming changes.

More to be elaborated on in the future development thread later on.

As for the coaster reactions and publicity I am loving some of the ones I have been seeing on social media from the GP. Some of the best ones can be found on KY3's Facebook page. They are downright hilarious.

Well that's a juicy little nugget. Not a shock, but definitely great for continuing the discussion that's been swirling around this very topic here for quite some time. I'm definitely a very big fan of the classics, but wouldn't necessarily mind scrapping any of them IF the intent was to recreate a similar ride experience with new and more reliable technology. FITH will always hold a special place in my heart as it was the first "coaster" I ever rode. And as much as I love coasters, it's such a shame that parks these days tend to overlook the inherent value in the simplicity of well done rides that most of the masses can enjoy, e.g., a well done flume, or dark ride.

There is plenty of truth to addition by subtraction. Just hope whatever we would potentially lose might make way for the creation of something even better that could cement itself as a SDC classic for generations to come. 

25
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2018 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: August 20, 2017, 12:46:19 AM »

Helix
$30 million
Height – 135 ft.
Length – 4,531 ft.
Speed – 62mph
Inversions – 7
LSM's – Two

Time Traveler
$26 million
Height - 100 ft.
Length – 3020
Speed – 50.3
Inversions –3
LSM's – 2
 

Helix has escalators to get to the queue building for gosh sake. In the grand scheme of things, they're about equal.


 :D Doubt it. If that proves to be the case, then the folks at Liseberg paid a few million bucks for a couple escalators.

26
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2018 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: August 18, 2017, 10:55:44 AM »
Josh, Shave or Swoosh, from your site tour experience and having seen the loading station and current queue, can you tell us if there will be any observation areas similar to WF? With their desire to promote ridership, I would think they would want to give patrons a great view of the experience. Even with a strong opposition to the spinning concept, I still won't make my final judgement, or decision on whether or not to ride until I'm able to see it in action with my own eyes first. 

I will say it's painfully obvious that a sizable chunk of SDC's $26 million investment was eroded due to the work it simply took to place a coaster in this location. As others have echoed, I'm also a bit underwhelmed and confused at the lack of adding any thematic elements beyond the station. Even a simple building over a portion of portions of the ride would add greatly to it.

Beyond the drop out of the station, the spinning element looks to be the only thing remotely unique about it. Compare the ride statistics to that of Mack's Helix coaster and it's clear the majority of the budget for TT was simply spent on excavation, concrete and developing the magnetic control mechanism for the trains.

Call it presumptuous and/or subjective, but when all is said and done, I would bet the farm that Helix is a far superior ride experience. Just wish they wouldn't have relied on what appears to be a gimmick in an effort to drive sales. A coaster as simple as PK continues to proven that a thoughtful design simply utilizing the nature around SDC can provide a lasting experience that demands repeat visitors and ridership. 

Helix
$30 million
Height – 135 ft.
Length – 4,531 ft.
Speed – 62mph
Inversions – 7
LSM's – Two

Time Traveler
$26 million
Height - 100 ft.
Length – 3020
Speed – 50.3
Inversions –3
LSM's – 2
 

27
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2018 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: August 16, 2017, 09:04:16 PM »
I know this post will probably get buried with all the discussion on the new ride but for those interested, here are some photo highlights from today. Got photos and video of the ceremony and as a bonus we also got to tour the station AND the coaster itself.

FULL ALBUM FROM TODAY IS HERE






Thank you for the great photos, Josh. Would you mind sharing your impressions from the day? Interested in perspectives from you, Shave and Swoosh based on your experience. While I'm disappointed about the type of coaster announced, from someone who has followed this process since day one and watched the announcement in its entirity on Facebook today, I feel like SDC did a nice job of having their ducks in a row and making it a very thorough presentation. Many details I appreciated for sure.

28
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2018 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: August 16, 2017, 06:21:50 PM »


If anyone thinks the "controlled spinning" on TT is going to be more tame than this on any level, I think you're kidding yourself. I just scanned the comments from SDC's official announcement on FB and I would say at least 25-33% of the comments echo the concerns about spinning and being bummed about never getting on the ride.


I think you need to go back to the video and listen to Brad Thomas' comments about the spinning.  What you're talking about on Spinning Dragons is EXACTLY what Brad said he DOESN'T want on the coaster- free, fast spinning that can get people sick.  Much to much spinning, much to fast, and this will NOT do that.  It is a very slow rotation that has built in brake controls so that it can not spin fast.  This has no chance of getting you dizzy or disoriented anymore than any other coaster because of how slow they are going to allow the cars to spin.

I understand your fears, but I don't think you're understanding the limits they are putting on the rotating that will prevent what you are afraid of.

Sure hope you're right, but I'm not buying it. Spinning is spinning and as I pointed out in an earlier post produces forces far different from that of other more traditional coasters. I think it's comical that this coaster's uniqueness was  sold on it being a spinning coaster that does XYZ, but Brad had to go out of his way to downplay the very thing that is supposed to make it unlike any other in the world.

I do think it only fair to reserve full judgement until the ride is operational, but whether you're on board with the spinning element or not, as long as it does spin, I am shocked that SDC chose to bank their largest investment in history with a ride that will statistically alienate a significant portion of the people who visit before they even get through the turnstiles.

Just think for a second about how the percentages quickly dwindle for park patrons who will never set foot on TT:

A percentage of patrons will not ride any rides.
A percentage of patrons will not meet the requirements to ride.
A percentage of patrons will visit and enjoy rides, but are not thrill seekers, or coaster enthusiasts and will not ride. 
A percentage of patrons will visit who enjoy coasters, but are unable to tolerate inversions.
A percentage of patrons will visit who enjoy coasters, but are unable to tolerate spinning rides.

That's a $26 million gamble that could have easily been minimized by incorporating the ability to allow the rider to dictate his/her ride experience as it relates to the spinning. Obviously, I am of the opinion that this omission would have made a bigger splash in terms of touting so many "world's only/firsts" in the coaster arena.

As I said above and in earlier posts, I applaud SDC on its willingness to continue pushing limits. I only hope public feedback will either prove me wrong, or force their hand into tweaking the experience at some point sooner than later. 

29
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2018 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: August 16, 2017, 04:03:30 PM »
Let me preface this post with the fact that I can and enjoy riding every coaster currently on park without any issue at all. I've ridden Pandemonium at SFSTL once, hated every second of it and won't ever ride it again. Video attached (not my ride experience, just pulled for reference).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Raogy49tOYU

If anyone thinks the "controlled spinning" on TT is going to be more tame than this on any level, I think you're kidding yourself. I just scanned the comments from SDC's official announcement on FB and I would say at least 25-33% of the comments echo the concerns about spinning and being bummed about never getting on the ride.

I hope more than ever I am so wrong about this, but I think not giving the rider some control over a spin or no spin option is a huge miss with this ride. Very anxious to see how it all shakes out once its up and running.

30
Construction/Rumors / Re: SDC's 2018 Project(s) and Park Developments
« on: August 16, 2017, 12:51:11 PM »
I hope we get more theming than was presented in the video. And while it won't effect me, I do think SDC will face an uphill battle in marketing to people who do not like spinning. I think the controlled spin will definitely help and the animation didn't look out of control to me. It just looks more like a turning motion than spinning. I think everyone should give it a chance before immediately shooting it down.

This looks like a great addition to the park and will offer something completely different from anything they have. I can't wait for 2018 to come to enjoy this amazing new addition. Three inversions, two launches, that first drop! Looks crazy and fun to me!

The animation doesn't show any spinning at all beyond the inversions. It just shows a traditional rider POV.

You can see the spinning in the animation. I wasn't just talking about the POV.

I'm talking about the rider POV. I don't care what the spinning looks like to the bystander.

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